Curse

Terraban · Dec 04, 2007, 03:09 AM // 03:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gambit Shinobi

Don't worry, Kwan Xi, some people like to bash others when they don't conform to cookie-cutter builds.

My Warrior is good at healing with Restoration too. I bring a staff, and max out restoration. Totally helps the team. I get compliments all the time since like, we have two monks, and I am healing too, and we never dies.

Kwan Xi · Dec 04, 2007, 03:19 AM // 03:19

With Motivation Paragons my Motivation Strength is usually 12-15: I almost always bring these skills...

Signet of Synergy, Mending Refrain or Finale of Restoration, Song of Restoration, Ballad of Restoration, Aria of Zeal, Signet of Return

Then Depending on what's needed I would either bring certain Skills to help the party out

Tactics: 10-12
"Watch Yourself!", "Shields Up!"

Leadership: 6-12
Anthem of Flame, "There's Nothing to Fear!", Hexbreaker Aria

Protection Prayers: 7-10
Mend Ailment, Mend Condition, Dismiss Condition, Remove Hex

Spear Mastery: 9-12
Spear of Lightning, Barbed Spear

There are lots more combos I use but Generally I bring the above 5 Motivation skills almost all the time and add these extra skills depending on what the Team Needs. I usually take along my Fiery Sunspear of Shelter for the extra +5 Energy.

Mathias Deathwater · Dec 04, 2007, 03:57 AM // 03:57

Paragons aren't monks, and motivation really isn't worth it to run as your primary job. The power of a paragon comes from its ability to dish out damage while giving the party massive buffs; they're really subpar as healers. Yes, they can work in pve, but as many people before me have stated, almost anything works there.

Kwan Xi · Dec 04, 2007, 04:20 AM // 04:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mathias Deathwater

Paragons aren't monks, and motivation really isn't worth it to run as your primary job. The power of a paragon comes from its ability to dish out damage while giving the party massive buffs; they're really subpar as healers. Yes, they can work in pve, but as many people before me have stated, almost anything works there.

Notice that I never said Paragons are Monks. As I said earlier paragons are a SUPPORT CLASS, meaning they help the team as they are needed. Motivation to help Monks, Spear to help with damage dealing, and Command Buffs to help the Party's Defense/Offense.

Paragons aren't meant to Replace Monks, Warriors, Rangers, or whatever they are to "SUPPLEMENT" the team. Help the Monks, and Warriors not replace them help the party in one or even two areas of need either with damage, heals, or buffs.

Ninian_Grace · Dec 05, 2007, 03:57 PM // 15:57

besides the fact that Anet has been massively stomping and ruining Paragons lately...meh they own. that is mainly the reason why they nerfed them 4-5 times.

as for their popularity, people did not have time to experience how TNTF, GFTE and agresive refrain used to own. they are still awesome skills...just not as good as they were...

The only thing I hope is that they won't nerf characters, skills and monsters over and over again in GW2...just like they are doing with GW1. In my opinion, there are testers for this game...? once the skills are put online, leave em the way they are. We can think here about prot bond + divine boon, those were the days were the trading forums were FILLED with traders. *drools*

Savio · Dec 05, 2007, 04:06 PM // 16:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kwan Xi

With Motivation Paragons my Motivation Strength is usually 12-15: I almost always bring these skills...

Signet of Synergy, Mending Refrain or Finale of Restoration, Song of Restoration, Ballad of Restoration, Aria of Zeal, Signet of Return

...

There are lots more combos I use but Generally I bring the above 5 Motivation skills almost all the time and add these extra skills depending on what the Team Needs. I usually take along my Fiery Sunspear of Shelter for the extra +5 Energy.

I've heard that adrenaline, Leadership, and spears are good.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninian_Grace

In my opinion, there are testers for this game...? once the skills are put online, leave em the way they are.

There are threads in Riverside Inn for this kind of drivel.

Kwan Xi · Dec 05, 2007, 07:31 PM // 19:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Savio

I've heard that adrenaline, Leadership, and spears are good.

There are threads in Riverside Inn for this kind of drivel.

Yes they are good and if my team wants me to help deal damage I can bring them. (feel free to actually read some of those supplement skills I list a few Spear, Adrenaline, Leadership skills as examples)

Just because I bring a +5 Energy Spear to run motivation doesn't mean I don't use any Spear Mastery Skills at all I just don't use them all the time. When I can use my Spear Mastery I bring out a 20/20 15>50 +30HP Spear if that makes you feel happy.

When I'm asked to go Motivation my primary job is to do Motivation first, Spear damage second.

Savio · Dec 05, 2007, 09:55 PM // 21:55

There is no reason why you shouldn't have adrenaline skills, Leadership, and Spear Mastery in any good Paragon build, not as some optional component. If you had those, you wouldn't need a +5e spear, nor would you need to run a crappy partywide heal build.

Kwan Xi · Dec 06, 2007, 04:14 AM // 04:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Savio

There is no reason why you shouldn't have adrenaline skills, Leadership, and Spear Mastery in any good Paragon build, not as some optional component. If you had those, you wouldn't need a +5e spear, nor would you need to run a crappy partywide heal build.

I guess you might have been too short sighted to notice that I use the +5e Spear when I have no skills in Spear Mastery. In situations where I have 0 Spear Mastery a 15>50 Spear isn't going to much anyway so why bother with it?

As your saying any good Paragon Build sure there's room for Spear Mastery and sure theres nothing wrong with that I run Spear Skills when I'm Motivation too (see the variants from my earlier post).

Ask yourself this... If your job is to help your team's monk with healing the party and the group has 3 Warriors 3 Elementalists and 1 monk are they really going to be angry if you have 0 Spear Mastery when your skills are diverted somewhere else? like say Tactics? or Protection/Healing Prayers? Are they really going to miss the damage you could be doing? Will they get mad that your helping with healing? buffing? or Condition/hex removal?

A good Paragon Build just like any good build is one that effectively helps the Party. Just doing damage as a Paragon isn't everything, Help the Team survive first, Kill everything that moves second.

Terraban · Dec 06, 2007, 04:27 AM // 04:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kwan Xi

I guess you might have been too short sighted to notice that I use the +5e Spear when I have no skills in Spear Mastery. In situations where I have 0 Spear Mastery a 15>50 Spear isn't going to much anyway so why bother with it?

As your saying any good Paragon Build sure there's room for Spear Mastery and sure theres nothing wrong with that I run Spear Skills when I'm Motivation too (see the variants from my earlier post).

Ask yourself this... If your job is to help your team's monk with healing the party and the group has 3 Warriors 3 Elementalists and 1 monk are they really going to be angry if you have 0 Spear Mastery when your skills are diverted somewhere else? like say Tactics? or Protection/Healing Prayers? Are they really going to miss the damage you could be doing? Will they get mad that your helping with healing? buffing? or Condition/hex removal?

A good Paragon Build just like any good build is one that effectively helps the Party. Just doing damage as a Paragon isn't everything, Help the Team survive first, Kill everything that moves second.

This is what makes you fail.

By that logic, you would be better off bringing a third monk.
Or bringing a restoration warrior.

Puzur · Jan 09, 2008, 10:42 AM // 10:42

Paragons are really good as a support class specially in elite areas. When I play mine I can keep everyones energy regenerating fast between battles, increase armor and reduce damage to entire party in battle and also counter some degen to the entire party.

zwei2stein · Jan 09, 2008, 12:14 PM // 12:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kwan Xi

I guess you might have been too short sighted to notice that I use the +5e Spear when I have no skills in Spear Mastery. In situations where I have 0 Spear Mastery a 15>50 Spear isn't going to much anyway so why bother with it?

As your saying any good Paragon Build sure there's room for Spear Mastery and sure theres nothing wrong with that I run Spear Skills when I'm Motivation too (see the variants from my earlier post).

Ask yourself this... If your job is to help your team's monk with healing the party and the group has 3 Warriors 3 Elementalists and 1 monk are they really going to be angry if you have 0 Spear Mastery when your skills are diverted somewhere else? like say Tactics? or Protection/Healing Prayers? Are they really going to miss the damage you could be doing? Will they get mad that your helping with healing? buffing? or Condition/hex removal?

A good Paragon Build just like any good build is one that effectively helps the Party. Just doing damage as a Paragon isn't everything, Help the Team survive first, Kill everything that moves second.

Your problem is this:

You don't understand what makes paragon good.

Paragon is good class because he can fulfill "duality" role of being excellent damage dealer while providing superb support, with no real loss. You are NOT going to replace monk, nor are you going to replace monk, you are only going to make healing a lot easier.

By doing only one of that, you are wasting your potential.

Your build with "7 support skills + res" is equivalently as bad as build of "7 attack skills + res".

Puzur · Jan 09, 2008, 07:56 PM // 19:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by zwei2stein

Your problem is this:

You don't understand what makes paragon good.

Paragon is good class because he can fulfill "duality" role of being excellent damage dealer while providing superb support, with no real loss. You are NOT going to replace monk, nor are you going to replace monk, you are only going to make healing a lot easier.

By doing only one of that, you are wasting your potential.

Your build with "7 support skills + res" is equivalently as bad as build of "7 attack skills + res".

If you consider both those builds equally bad you are the one that don´t understand what makes paragons good

Racthoh · Jan 09, 2008, 09:36 PM // 21:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Puzur

If you consider both those builds equally bad you are the one that don´t understand what makes paragons good

Both of those builds are equally bad.

upier · Jan 09, 2008, 09:52 PM // 21:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racthoh

Both of those builds are equally bad.

The sad thing is that doesn't matter.
PvE is so messed up that both builds would work! (Which is the reason why it's a tad hard explaining why something isn't good despite it working!)

Puzur · Jan 10, 2008, 02:26 PM // 14:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racthoh

Both of those builds are equally bad.

How can they be considered equally bad? With 7 attack skills and res everyone has to keep saving YOU, with one build focused on defence you save THE OTHERS?

Racthoh · Jan 10, 2008, 09:31 PM // 21:31

You don't need 7 skills to keep the party alive. Why you would waste every single slot to do that when you could be dealing damage so stuff is dying so you don't need to heal is beyond me.

Brian the Gladiator · Jan 10, 2008, 10:07 PM // 22:07

Wow! Stop talking about how paragons are great and how people underestimate them. Stop talking about how people are ignorant to the many uses of the paragon. Stop talking about how the reason people aren't playing them is because they think that the damage isn't good enough.

THE REASON WHY PEOPLE DON'T PLAY PARAGONS IS FOR THE SIMPLE FACT THAT PEOPLE THINK PARAGONS ARE OVERWELMINGLY THE MOST BORING CLASS TO PLAY IN THE GAME!!!

Racthoh · Jan 10, 2008, 10:18 PM // 22:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian the Gladiator

THE REASON WHY PEOPLE DON'T PLAY PARAGONS IS FOR THE SIMPLE FACT THAT PEOPLE THINK PARAGONS ARE OVERWELMINGLY THE MOST BORING CLASS TO PLAY IN THE GAME!!!

Tanknspank IMO is much more boring than playing my paragon.

Brian the Gladiator · Jan 10, 2008, 10:31 PM // 22:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racthoh

Tanknspank IMO is much more boring than playing my paragon.

I know not everyone will agree with the majority, but again, it is the majority.

Also, saying you don't like a specific build that is played on a different profession isn't countering my original statement. I'm guessing that, by saying "tanknspank" you mean a Warrior using defensive skills with the intention of attracting NPC agro and reducing the damage while others dish it. If this is in fact what you mean, then don't use that build. If you are trying to suggest that Paragons in general are more fun than Warriors, I am guessing there will be a TON OF PEOPLE ready to flame/disagree with you.